Has anyone heard when the final GEC Layer will be pushed?

It's been 5 weeks since the deadline to make our last modifications in our Layer content has passed. I won't be able to fix any problems, but I'd sort of like to check the changes I busted my buns to make before the last stages of senile dementia set in.

I did hear a rumor last week (May 30th) that an attempt to perform a clean scrape this week was planned, but that depended upon current work load being completed with no more interruptions,,,,,so, hoping and trying, but no date set in concrete.

Thanks.

Google always seems to have its own version of time concerning which, with the possible archiving of oGEC, seems to move at a glacial pace. And these days glaciers are perhaps outpacing Google. 

Lol! Good one, Hill.

There's a lot of moving parts, and the guys who're working on it are doing a Herculean effort. These folks are working weekends on Google Earth, and are trying to get the scrape done as part of the effort. I'll ping them again to see where we are.


Cheers,


    - CraigD 

Jun 9, 2015 20:02:50 GMT craigd said:

There's a lot of moving parts, and the guys who're working on it are doing a Herculean effort. These folks are working weekends on Google Earth, and are trying to get the scrape done as part of the effort. I'll ping them again to see where we are.


Cheers,


    - CraigD 

I know you guys are working your buttocks off. It's just that Google sometimes is way too frugal with the amount of staff they are willing to allocate to projects. I first saw this when Robin was getting hired. He was told it would happen but it seems the process went on for half a year. 

One bit of good recent news is that apparently someone was able to put in some time on the Sky maps layer and get them to work again. The last I heard it seemed like they were not going to allocate anyone time to work on it. Things happen, but to a civilian it seems they often happen very slowly due to non allocation of resources.

I'm sure you're doing a great job. Or I miss / fail / do not have access to see what is being done... or whats the problem.

You indicate that there for the last long period of time only has been delta updates, like only new/updated files being updated. This are backed up by the fact that for the last 2+ years of oGEC we have had to trigger a GEC layer file update by making a thread bump.

Now you announce that you will do one last total scrape. So at this last moment of the oGEC and GEC layer you introduce a complete new and most likely unproven scrape model as the last and final scrape...

I wont ask for anything like future visions of scrape, but please do a final oGEC scrape properly, even if you have to do it 3 or 4 times to do it right :-)

Layer scrape is of course a part of the Google Earth software complex. BUT, this is initial only a reading of kml/kmz files description and pasting the originating post into all the blue i'es. Like it has been for the most of the last about 10 past years.

All the best
Tom

"... but please do a final oGEC scrape properly, even if you have to do it 3 or 4 times to do it right :-)
"

Hi Tom

This is exactly what we're doing, and why it's much more complex than the previous delta-type scrapes. We're trying to do it right and make sure that the posts that should be published, are indeed there, and vice versa.

Don't worry, we haven't forgotten, and I'll update when there's more info.

Cheers,

    - CraigD

I am a new member to the GEC and don't yet understand what this "pushing" thing is all about.  However I have been happily surfing GE for many years - probably all 10!  In all of that time I have had MANY hours of pleasure, collected a long list of icon locations for my own file and noted several annoying things, mostly about GEC icons.  I don't have a clue whether all of these old icons will disappear in this "push" thing or not, but it is perhaps time for a bit of constructive commenting.

1.  WW2 British defense structures:  The Battle of Britain was a wondrous and important event.  One of the GEC members has taken GREAT time and care to spot and pay homage to EVERY defense position created during the war as a separate GEC post.  I can only imagine the time and dedication for that task!  I do a lot of surfing around the British Isles and it seems most of the GEC icons I run into in Great Britain are THESE.  These are important, but should really be on a separate layer of some type so an not to muddy the GEC unnecessarily.

2.  It seems that some GEC members crowd the earth with separate icon posts of every lineal yard of a race they have recently run (whatever) resulting in long streams of icons that seem to stick around forever.  Should there not be a time limit to this type of post or even a "rule" against them?

3.  Then there are the members who post "What is this?" or something else equally inane.  Why?

For me these things degrade the excellence of the GEC and might want to be addressed.

Thank you.

I am a new member to the GEC and don't yet understand what this "pushing" thing is all about.

Hi arniestuboud,

On April 4, 2015, >>the Google Employee in charge of coordinating the old Google Earth Community<< announced that the old GEC would be closed at the end of April. He also announced the creation of this forum, the new Google Earth Community, which has no official connection with Google itself, although most of the staff were also volunteer moderators in the oGEC.

Members were given a month to make changes in their posts, before the contents would be locked, and the only control the poster would have would be to delete the post. The FAQ section seemed to promise that there would be one last and final update of the GEC Layer.

FAQ:

Will there be a final publish of my KML content into the GEC layer in Google Earth?
    Yes, we’ll keep the GEC open for a month so people can update or add KML data that they’d like to be published into the GEC layer in Google Earth.

What happens to the GEC Layer in Google Earth once the GEC forum is frozen?
    After that month, all of the existing KML content will be published and the layer will be frozen, but available to view in Google Earth.

Will I be able to delete my content from the frozen GEC if I feel it is no longer up to date?
    Yes. After the GEC is frozen, you’ll be able to log in and delete your posts if you feel they are no longer applicable.

What is the projected timing of this?
    May 1st is the planned freeze date for the GEC, giving folks four weeks to update their posts.

Will I still be able to download KML from the GEC and view it in Google Earth, once it is frozen?
    Yes, all topics and KML files will remain available to view, unless personally removed by the creator of the content.

How long will the GEC remain available online?
    We have not set a date, nor do we see a reason to remove the GEC, but will retain the option if it’s ever needed.

Unlike the one month we were given to make final changes, nothing more precise than "after that month" was said about when the last update of the GEC Layer would be published. (The process of publishing the GEC Layer, as I understand it, is done in two parts: The first step is to collect selected information (title, coordinates, written description) from the KMZ files posted. This step is called "the scrape". The second step is to create Layer placemarks from this selected data and publish them in the Layers section of Google Earth. This step is called "the push".

In the past, this process seldom took no longer that 8 weeks. As the old coordinator explained, a different, presumably better, process is being employed to produce this last version of the GEC Layer. It is now 5 months since the oGEC content has been locked, and almost 2 months since we were promised a progress update. As you can see, some of our moderators seem to think it will eventually happen. Maybe it will. My mother fervently believed that she would live to see The Rapture. I, myself, am starting to have doubts that either will occur in my lifetime.

I agree with everything you have said, but unfortunately since May 1, it has been too late to do anything about any of your suggestions.

Maybe we should just be happy about the scraps Google has left us. They appear to be planning to continue to support Google Earth itself. (Some in-the-know people were speculating that might disappear, or at least get no further updates.) Even without the GEC Layer, GE is one heck of a program, and while I have come to despise and distrust Google, I still love Google Earth.

Although we - the Moderators - are no longer part of the Google loop, our old friend, colleague and boss, CraigD, is still in regular touch. The last information we had regarding the final cleanup was at the beginning of August;  the final scrape had been completed and we were asked to "validate" it.  I use inverted commas, since such a task would be impossible in any reasonable timescale, given the number of posts and placemarks residing in the Layer, and each of us could only really scrutinize a few sample posts and report back our findings (which were generally favourable).

A couple of specifics:

Arnie -

I empathise with your comment regarding the posting of things like GPS tracks of "My Favourite Cycle Ride" containing hundreds of GPS-generated placemarks.  Normally we tried to shovel content like this into the Dynamic Data Layer, which was not (IIRC) scraped, to avoid pollution of the GEC Layer.  Similarly with "Every Bus stop in Bangalore" - type posts.

Many of the "What is this?" type placemarks will remain, largely due to the OP failing to edit his placemark title or remove it completely, having been given the answer to his question.  It was Google policy at the time - rightly or wrongly - that moderators should not edit posts since this might potentially give problems regarding the OP's rights and the traceability of the contents of the post.  However, in many cases this is not necessarily a bad thing that these placemarks remain, since they could possibly help subsequent viewers improve their aerial/satellite photography interpretation skills.  A case in point was the perennial question "What are these large green circles on the landscape?", referring to the circular fields in many of the more arid parts of the world, caused by centre-pivot irrigation systems.  FWIW, I personally hated to see the inelegant expression "W T F???" dotted about here and there all over the GE world.  As part of the final cleanup after the forum freeze I did a forum search for all the WTFs and moved all I could find into an unscraped forum.

"The Defence of Britain" series of posts was a mammoth task by a member called ctpies, documenting virtually every damn pillbox, bunker and air-raid shelter in Britain, and was a hugely important contribution to our understanding of the vast scale of the efforts made to secure our country at a time when we were standing alone against the Axis.  AT the time it was made, every scrapable sub-forum in the GEC could be individually enabled/disabled inGE - in other words, if you were interested in Science and Nature-type placemarks, you could switch off the Military and Transport etc Layers.  Sadly, it was decided to simplify the GE Viewer menu system and so all the subforums were lumped into the category "Google Earth Community" in the form in which you see it today - All, or Nothing!  I don't know the reason, but I can't find the "Defence of Britain" placemarks in the final scrape, so you may get your wish...

Tom:

You'll be pleased to know that your specific issue has been addressed, and will disappear after the final push.  This was one of the checks I carried out personally when validating the final scrape.

Washi:

As for the direction of Google Earth itself, certainly we have seen little or no serious development of the software over the last few years and for a while it seemed that Google's main focus was on its stunted cousin, Google Maps.  As I've said, we are now out of the Google information loop, but despite the disappearance of giants like Michael T Jones and Brian McClendon (the "fathers" of Google Earth) from the Google stable, we are assured that there is still a future for Google Earth.  Indeed, one of the reasons given for the delay in the final scrape/push is that the GE Team are frantically busy on the GE software; laudable, but it means that the Old GEC is very much on the back burner.  Let's hope they can get around to it, preferably before "The Rapture"!  

I'd also comment that despite your disillusionment with Google - the organisation - there are many decent individuals within its ranks who regret the passing of the Old GEC, and who have nothing but good wishes for the new GEC; indeed a significant number have been very generous in their sponsorship, and I'm proud to count them as friends.

Cheers,

Frank

Hi Frank,

I regret having chosen the word "despise" in my search for alteration with "distrust," when "disgust" or "disappoint" might have been a more accurate representation of my feelings. I certainly did not mean to cast stones at Michael Jones or Brian McClendon or any of the other creators. Nor did I wish to attack CraigD, although I did hope to provoke him into making good on his promise (since edited away) to get back to us. (I thought the "you" he was referring to included me, who checks at least once every day to see if the numerous changes I made in April have appeared in the Layer yet. I didn't realize that he was talking only to you moderators.) People usually think that Google is the most wonderful place in the world to work, but as I have followed his career since 2012, I wouldn't have his job for all of Google's jelly beans! He has had to 1) preside over the dismantling of the handmade modeling efforts, where he had real expertise and a creative steak, and deal with the frustration of modelers who had in good faith devoted thousands of hours to populate GE with their efforts, 2) undertake the thankless job of trying to force the round peg of the GEC into the square hole of Google Groups, and 3) preside over the degradation and eventual demise of the GEC. I don't think Craig was responsible himself for any of this. I could never keep up with his young, and fast, and hip life style, but on a personal level, I have a great deal of admiration for him. Since there is nobody else to be the public face of Google in all these thankless tasks, he has been a lightning rod for dissatisfaction with Google's policies. I never thought he made these policies himself, or did anything more than I did countless times in my own career, to wit, go along with directives I thought were wrong-headed, handed down from above, rather than give up and move on to a new job with even fewer jelly beans.

The Google Earth Community Layer could have been a really great thing. I will never forgive the nameless face of Google for deliberately creating policies that made it mediocre mud, and once the profit was rung out of it, shut it down. Shame, I say, shame!

Hi, Washi,

Thanks for the post and clarification!  You'll be interested to know that the final push for the oGEC Layer went live a few hours ago.  I don't imagine everyone will be happy - for example, some of my posts are missing their images, although I think this is probably an ImageShack problem, rather than a Google one;  perhaps I should have been a little more assiduous in checking them while I had the chance during the Freeze.  As it was, I was rather busy at the time trying to get this show on the road!


I hope it all worked well for you.


Cheers,


Frank 

Edit:  Oh, and while we're talking about things Google - I wonder why they found it desirable to go from a relatively handsome grown-up font in their logo to a rounded infantile font, very reminiscent of the primary-coloured plastic letters my children played with back in the '70s?  And I wonder how much they paid the marketing consultants?

Thanks Frank,

I must have just missed the push when I checked about 9 hours ago. I've looked at most of my stuff I really care about, and found a few minor glitches, but I suppose, given how fast I was working, that I am the source of the problems.

You have my sympathy with Image Shack. Just after the old, old GEC shut down about the end of 2012, they raised my fee from free to $38 US for six months, which, as it turned out, was only about half as long as I needed before I could get the revised content into the Layer. Any time you want some help to bad mouth Image Shack, you know where I live.

As for the new Glogo, I always say "don't fix what isn't broken," but what do I know?

Well Senior GEC Members I have learned quite a bit from your posts since my original polite rant last week.
THANK YOU.

Perhaps the best thing to do now is to simply wait for "future developments" from the man behind the green curtain at Father Google.  GE really is a world-changing tool.  It would really too too bad if the innovative company of ten years ago decided to just drop it or no longer update imagery and fail to support it for some reason.

OTHER GRUMPY ISSUES - (Don't get me wrong, I still LOVE GE!):

• Hotels/Motels:  Used to be you could use GE to plan hotel/motel accommodations because virtually ALL bed-down locations were noted on the place categories layer.  I used to do that regularly.  That seems to have changed.  Many such place marks have disappeared.  It may now be a difference of the venue PAYING for that place mark vs being a SERVICE to all comers.  Sigh!
• Interstate Highway Exit Numbers:  Here in Indiana I-69 is being extended from the southwest corner of the state approx 200 miles up to Indianapolis in the center of the state.  They simply added 200 to the existing state exit #s from Indianapolis. on north.  However RARELY do these exit #s change nationwide, and generally they do follow the mile marker organization.  Why can't these exit #s be included on the roads layer?
  
• Place Mark Icons:  Is there not a SIMPLE way to import more icons to select from?  The icon graphics from GE are limited and have changed over the years.  There are supposedly lists of many many creative icons out there, but HOW does one EASILY get them into the icon selection collection to STAY without having an advanced degree in GE manipulation?  K.I.S.S.!  I have even made some of my own over the years, but I need to "browse" for them in a ridiculously complex file tree.
• Moving Personal Place Marks in the "My Places" Folder Tree:  I have never been able to find a way to reorganize or
  move more than one personal place mark at a time from one folder to another.  Files management has
  moved on quite a bit in these last 10 years.  Seems that one should be able to hold down SHIFT or CTRL while selecting multiple place marks to move within "My Places".
  

Thank you again for all of your attention to this little "newbie's" posts.  At least someone is trying to be proactive out there (pro bono!) and it is much appreciated.

ArnieStu



 

Hi There

Just a couple of things to answer your Post

Place Mark Icons:

""The following is a collection of icons Google makes available for Google Earth and Google Maps.""    Google Earth/Maps Icons

There is also a link on the same Google Page where you can Download others  Map Icons Collection 

Moving Personal Place Marks -  to reorganize

This has been asked for since day 1 of Google Earth.  We are now way past 3650 days :-)

Norm,

Your Placemark Icons link seems quite useful.  Have you thought about posting it in the Tools forum?

In the category Natural Disasters most of the icons were what I would expect. However, that first one came as a bit of a surprise.



Has anyone mapped all of the zombie outbreak areas so that we may avoid them? 

Your Placemark Icons link seems quite useful. Have you thought about posting it in the Tools forum?

Hi Gregg,

You too, of course.

Sept 5, 2015 17:31:59 GMT washi said:

Norm,

Your Placemark Icons link seems quite useful.  Have you thought about posting it in the Tools forum?

Hi Washi

I thought everybody knew about the extra Icons available.. :-)  Yes I can add a Link to them in the Tools Forum


And to Gregg...  Your image does not show...  

Hi Folks,

The layer was published late last week, and should be live for everyone now.

Thank you for your patience, it was much more difficult to do a "from beginning of time" release than you might imagine.

Also, thank you for your hurried work and of course, your amazing contributions to the layer. 

Cheers,

    - CraigD